Dr. Scott and Tommy answer listener write in questions spanning from beginner to advanced fasting. They lend perspective from research, personal experience, coaching anecdotes, and watching long-term results unfold from challengers who continue to see results through the Fasting For Life Continuity group after a recent challenge.
Fasting For Life Ep. 87
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:00:01] Hello, I'm Dr. Scott Watier,
Tommy Welling: [00:00:03] And I'm Tommy Welling, and you're listening to the Fasting for Life podcast.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:00:08] This podcast is about using fasting as a tool to regain your health. Achieve ultimate wellness and live the life you truly deserve.
Tommy Welling: [00:00:15] Each episode is a short conversation on a single topic with immediate, actionable steps. We cover everything from fat loss and health and wellness to the science of lifestyle design.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:00:25] We started fasting for life because of how fasting has transformed our lives, and we hope to share the tools that we have learned
[00:00:30] Along the way.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:00:40] Hey, everyone, welcome to the Fasting for Life podcast. My name is Dr. Scott Watier, and I am here, as always, in a good friend and colleague, Tommy Welling. Good afternoon to you, sir. Hey, Scott, how are you? Rock and roll, my friend. We're going to be jumping into some of the listener questions today and do a little Q&A episode. I'm excited because there's some good conversation points in here from starter to intermediate to beginner excuse me, from beginner to intermediate to advanced fasting techniques. So I think it's going to be a great conversation and excited to have it.
Tommy Welling: [00:01:15] Yeah. Thank you, guys, for for some of your questions. Please keep doing that. We love to keep this conversational and love to see where, you know, where people are struggling and what we can do to to strategize and kind of get past that point.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:01:27] And it comes through ebbs and waves to ebbs and flows. There'll be times where I can't keep up with the inbox, and then there'll be times where it's kind of quiet, and then there'll be times where it's like, OK, there's not enough hours in the day to answer all these questions. Right. But there's definitely some good ones in here. And we just want to keep delivering content to you that is actionable. So one of the biggest, coolest pieces of feedback that we get from you all is that it's bite size, it's short. It's hopefully to the point if Tommy and I don't go off bantering in certain direction, some episodes, sometimes there's research, but there's always a couple of takeaway things that you can do. So if you're new to the podcast, thank you for joining us, please. I want to say subscribe, drop a five star rating and a review, because we prefer those. But it's now I guess the terminology is now called follow, because if you're just describing, it actually means you're paying for the podcast. Apparently, Apple's changed the rules, but we are here. You don't have to worry about that. So drop us. I guess it's a go and follow. That's a little bookmark symbol on wherever you get your podcast apps drop's review. Like we said, we prefer the five star kind and appreciate the new listeners as well as the old school ogg's that have been with us since the beginning. We are on episode four in the eighties, somewhere just rocking and rolling.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:02:50] I cannot believe that it has had this amount of traction, you know, when we started this back in the day. So it's what we want. Keep it conversational. Keep submitting your questions and appreciate you guys listening again. If you're new, go to the website. You can check us out. Deforesting pro-life dot com. You can download our free resources. We just built out a new resource page while Tommy did. We've got some new stuff coming in. Insulin assessment is up there. We've got the fast start guide, which will help you get fasting into your day to day life quicker. So go ahead. Check it out. And Tommy, let's start with one of the listeners questions that came in and what had happened was. Post breaking the fast and ingesting a balanced meal, right, so we always talk about getting some good fat, some lean protein, some healthy starchy veggies, some natural carbs. We do not subscribe to any one specific type of eating because we want this to be sustainable long term for everybody. Don't start a program if you can't see yourself doing it forever, because then that means you're just going to give back all the hard work and results that you work so hard to get. So when we're talking about food and breaking a fast, sometimes people will comment. And this question came in saying, hey, after I broke my fast, this is what I ate. I'll spare the details. It was a balanced plate, but I felt really tired and sluggish. What do I do? Yeah.
Tommy Welling: [00:04:14] Yeah. I got a couple of considerations here. And, you know, depending on on how long of a fast you were in coming into that meal, that can that can affect how you feel afterwards. Because if you're already in a state of ketosis and then let's say you have some significant carbohydrates or a larger meal, you know, to to actually break that fast, then that's going to require a greater insulin response, going to a tribute to the contribute to the feelings of tiredness afterwards as well.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:04:46] Yeah, and the second thing, which is it was funny because some of the this was in the Fasting for life community group where I originally saw the question, and then it was emailed in to us as well. Where? Some of the people have chimed up and said, well, I just I do jumping jacks at my workstation or I go for a walk or I do X, Y and Z. So I went in and I said, well, try one teaspoon of sea or Himalayan salt in about 15 to 30 ounces of water and boom, it'll kick you right out of it. And then a couple of days later, I noticed that the response was it absolutely worked. So she chose the salt truck. So sometimes just doing a little bit of helping with the electrolyte balance, getting some sea salt or Himalayan salt. One teaspoon in about 15 to 30 ounces of water can also help kick you out of that. Yeah, and lo and behold, it works. So there is a great question and consideration that we hear often. And thank you for the question, Debbie. Moving into another food water related question we get is I am consuming the recommended ounces of water that you guys recommend. So we really want to shoot for 90 ounces minimum on those, especially on those longer fasting days outside anything in the twenty twenty two, twenty four hour plus range, 90 ounces to 100. I feel better when I get 90 ounces in by about midday, and then I'll sip on on one the rest of the day. But right. This person I mentioned, I finally got my water feeling great. They've lost a bunch of weight. I think they're down 15 or 20 pounds. But water seems to increase my hunger. Any thoughts, any concerns? What do I do?
Tommy Welling: [00:06:32] Yeah, and, you know, that's one that comes up every once in a while, Waterton, especially if you're not really used to drinking that much water. It can kind of, you know, have have some unintended effects like increased hunger. Also, we get some reports of like it it seems to kick up my acid reflux a little bit more to. And so one thing I really like to do, especially on the longer fast, is just drop a few drops of like a trace mineral supplement in there. Kind of gives it this more like flat taste. And it's it's not sodium. It's mostly magnesium and a few other minerals in there. And and that can really help just stave off those those feelings of additional hunger with with larger quantities of water.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:07:18] Yeah, it's it's absolutely electrolytes. So I love the concentrates brand. We're not paid by them. But if they're listening, feel free to reach out the concentrates brand of generals. Hmm. It I'm so glad that they were reworked their formulation because the old formula, it did not fare well in my household outside of me. Who could just stomach it and put it down. Yeah. But the new more Bufford version, they've been around forever. Great company. I think on Amazon it's like twenty dollars and you get a big bottle, an eight ounce bottle that lasts a long time. It's like one teaspoon I think. Is the dose anywhere between thirty two excuse me, 30 to 40 drops depending on on on when you've purchased it. And that is absolutely. I start on the days. I know that I'm going to be going out doing pushing the window, maybe doing a 30 hour fast, going from lunch the day before to dinner that day. I will do this just in the morning as a proactive thing, as part of the normal routine. And I've noticed that it's also very helpful for me coming out of a longer fast when I break with, let's say, a dinner in the evening and it's a larger meal the next morning, adding these in. We'll just help with the cravings. So specifically back to this person's question. Tom, I don't remember the person's name. I didn't write it down or I can't read my handwriting here. But if you're noticing hunger increasing with water intake. Yeah. Try to trace minerals, the constant concentrate minerals and let us know. But that should be a good fix. Or one other consideration would be try to space your water out or maybe you're just drinking too much water for your body at that time.
Tommy Welling: [00:09:04] Yeah, that's that's true, too. And if you're drinking cold water, try try it a little bit warmer, because just the temperature of the water can affect those those feelings of hunger that come along with it. The colder the water is, the more the more I feel hungry for sure.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:09:18] Yeah, those are obviously. Antidotal. Right, so try it out, let us know. Give us some feedback and then a follow up question that is can sometimes be related to water and electrolytes and hydration. But most likely inflammation. This question came in and it had to do with tension in the wrists. And my radar went off where this most likely is an inflammation or a fluid retention type situation. So this came in from Gwen. Appreciate the question, Gwen. Can fasting help with tensions and the risks? I'm currently not able to play my harp or my dulcimer apologies on the pronunciation because I don't know what that is. For more than a few minutes at a time before my risk tell me to stop, I've also nearly quit crocheting and knitting. I want more music and crafts in my life. So, yes, we've done episodes specifically talking about fasting and inflammation. The most common thing that we hear that's reported back to us and what we've seen in the research that you and I have looked at, Tommy, is that it can indeed decrease inflammatory blood markers or inflammatory cytokines in your body. So you should absolutely see an improvement in these. Now, there are some additional considerations here, you know, in terms of overall health medications, you know, things that you might want to consider speaking to your doctor about or if if you know, you have an underlying like autoimmune issue like rheumatoid arthritis, you know, let them know that you are doing fasting. But we do have dozens of people reporting back and some research out there to show that even with those more advanced conditions, that you will see a reduction in tension or excuse me, a reduction in inflammation, which is usually the underlying cause of the tension. The other one time is the conversation we just had about hydration, electrolytes and salt.
Tommy Welling: [00:11:20] Yeah, it absolutely is. And it has to do with those things. Like you're going to feel more of those inflammatory markers. You're going to feel more of those things when you're in the state of, let's say, dehydration, or if you even have undue stress or, you know, you're you're sleep deprived at that point. But, you know, then then there's also the matter of how long are you fasting for? Because as we get into those longer fasts going 24 hours plus, we start to tap into the autophagy side of things on fasting scale. So some of those longer fast can actually really kick in the autophagy mechanisms within the body. So so, you know, integrating some longer fast into your weekly schedules might be a really good idea to kind of kick it up a notch for those anti inflammatory pathways.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:12:09] Yeah, that's a great point. I even thought about that until you just said it. So, yeah, if you're if you're not seeing the decrease in inflammation, let's say you're doing a six eight in your new day fasting and your intermittent fasting autophagy is typically kicks in around that 17 to 18 hour mark. So you might not even be at the point where you're starting that process. Right. And then, you know, for instance, you get to 24 hours, you're going to be talking about increased BDNF, which is the brain derived nootropic factor, which is, you know, for cognition and brain fog reduction and all those different types of things stem that intestinal stem cell regeneration at twenty four hours. And then, like you said, as you get up through the thirty to thirty six, where you're really getting decreased insulin levels that you haven't had in a long time, then you're going to start to see some some really cool things take place physiologically and everybody's a little bit different. So these are just, you know, approximate windows based on some of the research. And yeah, it's so if you are Tommy, great point. If you are in those earlier stages, maybe pushing the window by an hour or two over the course of a few days. So if you've been doing 18, 16, go to 18, go to 20, and you should start to see some improvement as well. So really good point there. Yeah. We have two more questions for today. One is about protein. And then we have one question about the. Doing longer fasts on a repeated schedule, and this is a question we get that has a lot of different nuance to it, so I'm sure we've talked about this before, and there's something that we've taught me.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:13:45] I think you came up with the names called fast cycling. So if you've been part of our continuity group or you've been in one of our challenges, this is where we talk about using different fasting windows, which is a change of framework. Then when you and I started, which was really just start with a one meal a day type framework. Right. So fast cycling is using these varied windows based on I'm going to put air quotes on this. This is an audio medium, but air quotes and aggressiveness to how much weight you want to lose or your intention behind fasting, which kind of leads to all of these different nuanced conversations. So for this question, it was very specifically I'll let you unpack this here, Tommy, is she had been part of the challenge and had gotten great results. So right now, down 32 pounds in just about six. I mean, look here real quick. It's about six going on seven weeks and down 32 pounds. Nice win. Just absolutely. Actually, she even says tally here says, holy crap, you guys are great. Thank you for your help and support. And I always say what? We're going to throw that right back to you, Tally, because you did all the hard work, right? You showed up and put the work in. But she had come off this this really great results. And she almost was kind of like tentatively like, OK, should I be continue to be doing these longer fasts? Yeah. And what's what's like where do I need to kind of take a break week, so to speak?
Tommy Welling: [00:15:14] Yeah. Like how do you how do you kind of think through that? How do you how do you plan when you're seeing results? And sometimes that can be so surprising, especially if you're coming from the eat less, move more low and slow, and you're not really used to seeing results like it can almost be a surprise to to a lot of folks in the challenge, like, oh, my gosh, like this is this is really working. And yeah, so so so where do we go from there? So, you know, fast cycling, like you alluded to, is is us, you know, bringing in some variation into our fasting schedules. You know, like a lot of people start with us, like you said on the fast start guide, you're going to you're going to see how to use one meal a day fasting, which is which is great. And, you know, before I came to fasting, what I heard most people talking about was was usually like a six eight type of schedule. But essentially that's that's time for like lunch and dinner, probably. It's almost like just skipping breakfast. And you you kind of end up with
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:16:08] This skipping breakfast and a snack and you're there.
Tommy Welling: [00:16:10] Sure. And you kind of you kind of end up with a sticks. And that's great. And it's better than kind of just all day willy nilly, you know, eating with no boundaries set. So it's it's great. And it's going to be an improvement for for insulin. But it's it's not necessarily what everyone needs to to drop old weight to tap into some of those old fat stores. Sometimes we're going to have to push the window a little bit and we're going to have to use some some varied schedules that kind of get at different different things. And like what we just talked about with the autophagy, getting some of those benefits and some of the most benefit that start to come in with some of those longer fast putting those into the mix, too. So, you know, so for her for actually repeating some longer, fast, and should she do it, it sounds like to me for her, she's found what's working. And there's really not a big reason to to stop doing what's working at that point.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:17:06] Yeah. Let me put a couple of parameters there. One thing I left out was she was at a plateau prior to doing the last challenge. And this. No, this is not. And we have another one coming up. I don't even know the date yet. Tell me we're getting close to announcing that. Yeah, it may be in the show notes. Yeah. Oh, so September 14th. Oh, excuse me. September 8th. Correct. OK. Yeah, September 8th, huh? OK, real, real. Like real life here. You guys are getting a peek behind the curtain. We set the date and then I literally in real time forgot September 8th is the next challenge coming up. And she had mentioned that she was at a plateau prior to doing the one that we did back back in June. And. To your point of whether or not to continue. Here are some things that I'll mention if your energy's good and you're sleeping well and you're you don't have a lot of hunger cravings, you're not hungry all the time and you're still seeing the weight go down and you've got energy and vitality. And I would continue to do what's working until your body gives you a signal that it's time to make a change. So as long as you're eating good nutrient dense foods during your fasting, you're feeding windows, you're staying hydrated and all of those things are in alignment, then. Yeah, absolutely. Keep writing, riding the the the fat loss train. Right. By the way, and continue to use those different longer fasts or we're talking about, you know, omad or doing a 30 or 36 hour fast once a week or doing a 48 hour fast once a week.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:18:40] Absolutely. Now, if you're starting to feel your cravings come up or your sleep is being disturbed or noticing you're a little more edgy or you're hungrier or you're not feeling satisfied with the foods and you are eating clean, nutrient dense foods, that it might be time to, you know, do a reverse fast or take a break and open up your window for 10 or 14 days and just kind of play around those different windows. But I didn't want to leave that consideration out. But yeah. Yeah, it's a great it's one of the things that we talk a lot about during Challenge week and then also in the continuity group. So if you want or you've been waiting or you're on the waitlist for the challenge or you don't even know what the challenge is, you can go to the show notes, it'll bring you to the page where you can get all of the dates, information and details. So one last question, Tommy, before we wrap up today's episode is the question about getting enough protein during a one hour or two hour eating window. And the question came in from Natalie, and she says, I've been doing just fine on the podcast. Thank you for listening. She's currently on episode 18. I appreciate your grace. We renew back then, still trying to figure it out. I've been doing 16 eight for about three weeks.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:19:56] She's not a tracker, but she's been consistently seeing results, interested in doing longer fasts after listening to the podcast, but hesitant because she won't get her protein needs met with one meal. So currently she's doing two meals and she forces a protein shake in and sometimes still doesn't meet the ninety five gram protein requirement goal. So question about protein, and there's different research out there about how much protein you should be taking. So if you're looking for lean body mass composition and overall health point seven is probably enough to get you there. Right. So one thing that is mistakenly done a lot in this realm is you're calculating your protein needs. And for some of you that don't track or even worry about this stuff than just hang tight. Before we wrap up today's episode, but you want to be looking at, you know, your end goal. So if your end goal is to weigh, let's say, one hundred and forty pounds. Right. So multiplying that by point seven is going to get you about 98 grams of protein, which is this example or this question came in with ninety five grams of protein. Yeah. So a chicken breast has about forty three grams. So if you're just eating now for some of you might be like, oh man, eating two full chicken breasts and one meal. That seems like a lot. OK, well then exactly. Do what she's done here and just your window out a little bit to make sure you're getting what you feel is necessary for you.
Tommy Welling: [00:21:21] Yeah. Yeah. Sometimes you have to give yourself a little bit more of an eating opportunity, you know, and then it's like that's not a reason to just have more food or like go to the pantry. Like this is not a reason to snack more. Right. But if you feel like there's there's a potential like a a particular nutrient that you need more of a you need a little bit more time to do that. That's okay. And, you know, maybe instead of doing, you know, 18 hour fast, now you go to a 20 hour fast and, you know, just just keep keep keep the boundaries to to keep going towards your long term goals. And and what is what is your long term goal? Because if you're in a maintenance phase versus a fat loss phase, then then that can look very different to you have two different kinds of opportunities there to to get in your nutrients. And then and also, if you just have a few pounds to lose and you want to do that through a couple of longer fasts, then maybe putting that requirement aside for maybe a week or two is is probably a good off for for hitting some more long term goals. Right. And then and then bring it back into the forefront.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:22:25] That's OK, too. Yeah. Yeah. So the other I love that consideration because there's the opposite. I want to come back to that the opposite situation. There would be, you know, putting in a longer, fast one or two days a week and just making sure you're getting your weekly average of protein consumption to a level that you're comfortable with. So you'll you'll have maybe a day or two where you're you're not fasting or are you doing more of the intermittent like she had mentioned, and you have the ability to get two or three smaller meals and and a protein shake. Right. So it's that consistent consumption of week to week, which is going to give you the long term results. So I love that point of maybe relaxing that just a little bit and then just staying consistent over the weeks to months rather than that consistent need to hit that metric every single day. Yeah. And even if you want to bump it up to one, if you're doing more muscle building and you're working out doing weights five days a week. But yeah, you might want to up that a little bit, but then also open your window up on those on those workout days.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:23:28] You try to give yourself a little bit of flexibility. So I know one of the other considerations here is that you can also do it off of lean body mass, because fasting does have a growth hormone component or a spike to it. And it's that is not anabolic meaning muscle building, but it is lean muscle protective. You're having elevated growth hormone muscles, allows your body to get into fat burning. So even for someone like myself who has 170 plus pounds of lean muscle on their frame, you know, getting that amount of protein in long term, being at that size, lifting all the weight that I used to lift, that just wasn't sustainable for me. So I've been able to decrease my body weight, decrease my protein need and decrease the calculations of, oh, how much do I need to get in? And eventually you'll just find kind of a, uh, a rhythm of of consistency that's going to work for you. But if you're in a fat loss phase. Yeah. Keep doing what you're doing. And if you hit five out of seven days, you're going to be perfectly fine.
Tommy Welling: [00:24:30] Yeah. Yeah. The body doesn't doesn't freak out over like minute to minute or hour to hour. It changes within those averages. You know, I look at it. Zoom out just a little bit, give us some great perspective, your hidden, hidden, some good goals and you're on the right track, so keep it up.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:24:44] Yeah, sounds great. Thank you for listening, Natalie. And at the end, she says, by the way, loving your podcast, making my way through them as fast as possible while slow down, Natalie, because right now, Tommy and bandwidth is about one episode a week. We're working on changing that. I know if you guys meet with us, you've been hearing us say that we're thinking about doing interview series and expanding the breadth of what it is that we do, because we love it. We love it. We talk about it 24/7. If you're new to the podcast, go to the website. Check out the fast art guide, the resources tab. We have an insulin assessment on there. Shoot a question info at the fasting for life dot com. Give us a follow on wherever you get your podcast. As always, Tommy, thank you for the conversation. Thank you all for listening. And we'll talk soon. Thank you.
Tommy Welling: [00:25:26] So you've heard today's episode and you may be wondering, where do I start? Head on over to the fasting for life dot com and sign up for our newsletter where you'll receive fasting tips and strategies to maximize results and fit fasting into your day to day life.
Dr. Scott Watier: [00:25:40] Why are you there? Download your free fast start guide to get started today. Don't forget to subscribe on iTunes, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Make sure to leave us a five star review. And we'll be back next week with another episode of Fasting for Life.
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